a cache of usenet and other text files pertaining
to occult, mystical, and spiritual subjects.


Thelemites and Society

To: alt.magick.tyagi,alt.magick,alt.magick.order,alt.thelema,talk.religion.misc,talk.religion.newage
From: (nigris (333))
Subject: Re: Thelemites and Society
Date: 12 Jan 1998 13:31:42 -0800

49971012 aa2 Hail Satan!

do what the fuck you want
most of the essay deleted, see the author for a copy of the context.

Nexist {DAR} :
# ...what would happen if every Thelemite...  were rounded up and 
# locked away?  

unlikely.  Thelemites would escape or turn the system around so that
the guards were then the inmates.  you're dwelling in the 'Thelemite
is the person who goes by this label' type of groupthink again.

# All in all, the net result on society would be nil.  

extremely false.  a horrid crime should a paralysis of real Thelemites
ever come into being.  again, I say it'd never happen.  people would
immediately recognize the problems inherent to such a maneuver.  this
is what WWII was fought over to a great extent.

# ...individuals are anonymous and replaceable within society....  

this is utterly false, and the ideals of the US of A demonstrate the
contrary.  the individual is replaceable on the *assembly line*, and
this is one of the problems with industrial society and mentality,
but in society the geniuses, the innovators, the unique and those 
who make Really Cool Things are compensated either while they are
alive or their heirs are lauded with fat wads of whatever the current
power-trading baubles happen to be.

to some extent one can look to the "tycoons" of a number of different
industries to see how Thelemites are treated by society.  and they
don't have to be rich.  look at Joshua A Norton as another example,
his aura inspired proper respect without his having to achieve fame
and power from works and literal station.

# those who are recognized by society are considered as exceptions to the
# group, rather than examples of that group.  

again, you're dwelling on the cultish identification schema of the neuvo-
'Thelemic' masquerade.  I say, wake up and smell the philosophy.  Thelema
is not a religion, it is demonstrated by the firm and strident of will
and seldom are those who are Thelemites identified as such, especially
by themselves.  didn't this come across in Crowley's or Rabelais' writ?

# What we need to do is form groups for the sole purpose of contributing to
# society.  

you need this.  MOO!

# Furthermore, these groups must be dedicated to Society and not just 
# Thelemites.  

cults tend to protect their own interests.  this is the way of the
religious.  groupthink usually leads to groupact, which leads to
groupoppression.  it is a sad but common pattern.

# If the only visible community work benefits
# the group directly (for example a Thelemic College Fund), then the 
# group is
# seen as selfish and the complaints of its activists are viewed as also
# selfish....

religious are typically selfish.  when the religious get big enough 
then this sometimes leads to a wide variety of public works and charities.
entire societies, especially if the religion loosens up a bit, will at
times become generous.  I think ascetic, mind-numbing, dissolutory and
martyring groups, when they achieve power, can do wonderful things for
the poor and helpless.  it is this which is Christianity's virtue, and
is demonstrated in the acts of people like Mother Teresa or the various
institutions who set up facilities to minister (bodily) to the poor and
destitute (often monastics undertake this as a kind of karma yoga, at
times on the basis of 'effacing their ego' and they ought to be seriously
commended for their efforts, however futile given the current trends).

# Until we, as a group, prove empirically to society that we care, why 
# should we expect society to care about us?  

who expects this?  who is 'we'?  I think the cult is best left behind.
the church, the rites, the religion can rot.  what does it do but lead
to its own perpetuation?  you're beginning to catch onto this perhaps.
development of AGAPE is where it is at, and that seems to happen outside
religious cults more than inside.  elsewise a lot of fragmentation and
focus on compassion and suffering has to occur before the transition is 

let society ignore "Thelemites".  they deserve to be ignored.  if they
do anything of note then it'll come to attention soon enough, won't it?  

on the OTHER hand, I think there is something to be said for 'working 
behind the scenes' in the shadows of a culture, fomenting inspired 
genius and doing the work of the shaman, walking between the worlds, 
evading the remuneration and glory of the Saint, attaining to the Ugly 
Face and yet fostering something in the CORE of the individual which 
may never be seen.  this is why I value Crowley -- he did what the 
FUCK he wanted and perhaps he achieved free love.

free love, right now!
nigris (333)/;
To subscribe send: 'subscribe thelema93-l' to
To unsubscribe send: 'unsubscribe thelema93-l' to
(emailed replies may be posted);; 408/2-666-SLUG
  join the esoteric syncretism in alt.magick.tyagi; 

The Arcane Archive is copyright by the authors cited.
Send comments to the Arcane Archivist:

Did you like what you read here? Find it useful?
Then please click on the Paypal Secure Server logo and make a small
donation to the site maintainer for the creation and upkeep of this site.

The ARCANE ARCHIVE is a large domain,
organized into a number of sub-directories,
each dealing with a different branch of
religion, mysticism, occultism, or esoteric knowledge.
Here are the major ARCANE ARCHIVE directories you can visit:
interdisciplinary: geometry, natural proportion, ratio, archaeoastronomy
mysticism: enlightenment, self-realization, trance, meditation, consciousness
occultism: divination, hermeticism, amulets, sigils, magick, witchcraft, spells
religion: buddhism, christianity, hinduism, islam, judaism, taoism, wicca, voodoo
societies and fraternal orders: freemasonry, golden dawn, rosicrucians, etc.


There are thousands of web pages at the ARCANE ARCHIVE. You can use ATOMZ.COM
to search for a single word (like witchcraft, hoodoo, pagan, or magic) or an
exact phrase (like Kwan Yin, golden ratio, or book of shadows):

Search For:
Match:  Any word All words Exact phrase


Southern Spirits: 19th and 20th century accounts of hoodoo, including slave narratives & interviews
Hoodoo in Theory and Practice by cat yronwode: an introduction to African-American rootwork
Lucky W Amulet Archive by cat yronwode: an online museum of worldwide talismans and charms
Sacred Sex: essays and articles on tantra yoga, neo-tantra, karezza, sex magic, and sex worship
Sacred Landscape: essays and articles on archaeoastronomy, sacred architecture, and sacred geometry
Lucky Mojo Forum: practitioners answer queries on conjure; sponsored by the Lucky Mojo Curio Co.
Herb Magic: illustrated descriptions of magic herbs with free spells, recipes, and an ordering option
Association of Independent Readers and Rootworkers: ethical diviners and hoodoo spell-casters
Freemasonry for Women by cat yronwode: a history of mixed-gender Freemasonic lodges
Missionary Independent Spiritual Church: spirit-led, inter-faith, the Smallest Church in the World
Satan Service Org: an archive presenting the theory, practice, and history of Satanism and Satanists
Gospel of Satan: the story of Jesus and the angels, from the perspective of the God of this World
Lucky Mojo Usenet FAQ Archive: FAQs and REFs for occult and magical usenet newsgroups
Candles and Curios: essays and articles on traditional African American conjure and folk magic
Aleister Crowley Text Archive: a multitude of texts by an early 20th century ceremonial occultist
Spiritual Spells: lessons in folk magic and spell casting from an eclectic Wiccan perspective
The Mystic Tea Room: divination by reading tea-leaves, with a museum of antique fortune telling cups
Yronwode Institution for the Preservation and Popularization of Indigenous Ethnomagicology
Yronwode Home: personal pages of catherine yronwode and nagasiva yronwode, magical archivists
Lucky Mojo Magic Spells Archives: love spells, money spells, luck spells, protection spells, etc.
      Free Love Spell Archive: love spells, attraction spells, sex magick, romance spells, and lust spells
      Free Money Spell Archive: money spells, prosperity spells, and wealth spells for job and business
      Free Protection Spell Archive: protection spells against witchcraft, jinxes, hexes, and the evil eye
      Free Gambling Luck Spell Archive: lucky gambling spells for the lottery, casinos, and races