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To: alt.magick.tyagi,alt.magick,alt.magick.order,alt.magick.tantra,alt.magick.sex,alt.thelema,talk.religion.misc,talk.politics
From: tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com (nigris (333))
Subject: Crowley and Paederasty
Date: 23 Jul 1999 22:07:10 -0700

---------------------------------------
~From: nagasiva@luckymojo.com (333)

49990128 IIIom

E6

I've been editing a text that I think the Crowleyite
community should consider very carefully when asking for
assurances such as the above as regards 'maturity' (I do
not know the context of Fr. Pir's comment). it is called
"Bagh-i-muattar", contains descriptions of obviously
paederastic (and often physically damaging) anal sex 
performed upon a "youth". this is written in the guise of 
a translated erotic Persian (sufi) poem in mimicry of Sir 
Richard Burton's translation of an authentic erotic 
Persian text (heterosexual and adult in nature).

now if Crowley was, as I have been assured by my frater
Bill Heidrick, the sole author of this text, and is known
to have enjoyed homoeroticism, then does this say something
about his 'level of spiritual maturity'?
 
for that matter, does anyone know who this is:

	HERBERT CHARLES JEROME POLLITT?

this name is enciphered into the first letters of each 
line in the chapter called 'The Riddle', and is an 
obvious challenge to the reader to decipher it (which,
to my enduring admiration, my partner catya acheived).

far from being the exotic Arab "youth" whose "podex"
is the obsession of Crowley's protagonist 'El Qahar',  
'Pollitt' would seem to have been British. the questions
remain: who was Herbert Charles Jerome Pollitt? what was 
his age relative to Crowley's? and was Crowley truly
engaged in the sexual abuse of boys? 

(warning to apologists: simply stating that one
believes or "knows" that Crowley wrote this work as
metaphor or satire will not suffice to cover over the
obvious reference to an encrypted admission.)

# Which brings to my mind a question. It seems to me that 
# K & C, like maturity, is reached at different ages by 
# different folks. If a teen under the legal age in your 
# locality has by one means or another successfully taken 
# on Magister Templi then it would seem to me that laws 
# prohibiting that person from entering into a sexual 
# relationship with anyone SHe chooses are an attempt to 
# restrict Hir Will....

all laws are attempts to restrict will. this is the role
of the immature establishment of a state that it sets up
restrictions so that its members harm one another in as
minute a manner as is possible. at the full blossoming
of social maturity only anarchism is palatable.

# While I certainly oppose preditors I am not sure that 
# ever member of NAMBLA would fall into this categorie.

the presupposition of the culture which forbids sexuality 
of those of adult maturity with the immature is that it is 
EQUIVALENT to predation on the basis that the immature are 
incapable of rendering informed decisions on matters so 
disorienting and powerful as sexuality. it is obvious that 
NAMBLA disagrees with this premise and therefore is 
composed of predators by the standards of the society in
which it has been formed.

E666
tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com (nigris (333))
----------------------------------------------------

~From: Bill Heidrick 

93,

[333] wrote:

>Is it a
>coincidence that OTO has had problems with NAMBLA members (in the Bay
>Area?) per Bill H.? Who knows? 

Might be coincidence.  Advocacy is not in itself necessarily a bar.  The
problems OTO incountered were: 1. A member abused a minors unbeknownst to
OTO, also unknown to OTO before the fact was his NAMBLA involvement.  We
expelled him and assisted prosecution.  2. another announced NAMBLA member
behaved very oddly, leading OTO to decline his application -- no details
for that one, since it does not involve illegal conduct.

>> H.C.J.P. was a transvestite dancer and was much older than Crowley.  He
>> was Crowley's homoerotic romance par excellence, and Crowley would 
>> many years later use Pollitt in his masturbation fantasies (check The 
>> Magical Record of the Beast 666).
>
>Look, folks:  this is contradictory. Was Pollitt a college buddy,
>"slightly older" ... or a transvestite dancer "much older" than Crowley? 
>
>Could someone with access to the cited books please provide a plausible
>answer? Thanks. 

~From: CONFESSIONS OF ALEISTER CROWLEY
Copyright (c) Ordo Templi Orientis:

                             -oOo-

                              17

     I began my last year at Cambridge with my moral decks cleared for
action.  I didn't know where I was going, but I was on the way.  I was thus
quite ready for the perception of the First Noble Truth, but also for an
entirely new current to influence my life.  Towards the end of the October
term I met a man named Herbert Charles Jerome Pollitt.  He was an M.A., ten
years older than myself, and had merely come up to Cambridge to dance for
the F.D.C. (Footlights Dramatic Club).  I saw him only once or twice that
term, but corresponded with him from abroad during the Christmas vacation.
The result was the establishment of the first intimate friendship of my life.
     Pollitt was rather plain than otherwise.  His face was made tragic by
the terrible hunger of the eyes and the bitter sadness of the mouth.  He
possessed one physical beauty --- his hair.  This was very plentiful and he
wore it rather long.  It was what is called a shock.  But its colour was
pale gold, like spring sunshine, and its texture of the finest gossamer.
The relation between us was that ideal intimacy which the Greeks considered
the greatest glory of manhood and the most precious prize of life.  It says
much for the moral state of England that such ideas are connected in the
minds of practically every one with physical passion.

                             -oOo-

>> Crowley was always the passive paederast and even wrote
>> a poem about it in White Stains (The Ballad of Paasive
>> Paederasty).
>
>Well, in the Bagh-I-Muattar Crowley wrote about fucking some "youth" up
>the ass until the boy bled from his anus. He went on quite at length
>about how delightful the blood looked, in fact. 

Recall that the Bagh-I was written in part as a satire, attributed by
Crowley as the work of a British clergyman.  That doesn't mean the details
in it were never true of Crowley, merely that some were colored for effect.
 It doesn't mean that Crowley did all of those things or otherwise
experienced them either.

93 93/93
Bill

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