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Neopaganism and Satanism

To: alt.satanism,alt.pagan,alt.religion.wicca,alt.magick.tyagi,talk.religion.misc
From: jasonp@argon.GAS.UUG.Arizona.EDU (Jason Posey )
Subject: Re: Neopaganism and Satanism (Was Re: Wiccans...alt.mgk (...Sweetness...)
Date: 6 Dec 1995 23:52:37 GMT

In article <4a2tpj$>,
Michael A. Schelp  wrote:
>Most pagans I know, and I know many, don't believe that any thing, man or 
>god, is all good or all evil.  

You fail to define what "good" and "evil" are. Does it mean "spiritual" 
versus "material," "orderly" vs "chaotic," "pleasant" vs "harmful," or 
"according to God's will" as opposed to "against God's will?"

Since Jehovah is all good and Satan is all 

Most Christian theologians would deny that Satan is all evil. He was, 
after all, they would say, created as an angel of light. Satan became 
"evil" when he rebelled against God, according to this argument, but is 
not "all evil," whatever that may mean. Some sects even believe that 
Satan will be saved on the Day of Judgement.

 they are outside our belief system.  Since I don't believe in an 
>all good god, how can I believe in an all evil one?  Therefor, Pagans are 
>not Satanists.  The difference between the pagan light/dark "battle' is 
>that none of the characters are totally good or bad.  

And *that* is entirely subjective.

That is a 
>fundemental difference.  A good example is the Norse belief in Ragnarok, 
>their "Armaggedon".  The Norse believed that the forces of evil, led by 
>Loki, would fight the forces of good.  

Some of the norse apparently believed this. Far from all. Some also 
believed that Thor or Tyr, not Odin, was the chief god. And some believed 
that the forces of Darkness would be led by Ymir, Fenriz, Hel, Surt,
Jormungand, or Nidhogg. And some no doubt believed that some of those 
were names for one and the same being, especially the last two.

Loki is NOT Satan.  He gave man 
>and the gods some of their greatest gifts.  

Satan, according to the Christian reading of the Torah, was responsible 
for the gift of knowledge to man. The books of Enoch claim that 
Semjaza/Azazel and the other rebel angels gave mankind virtually all 
the gifts of civilization. How does the giving of gifts imply that s
omeone isn't Satan?

Just because there is a 
>battle doesn't mean it's the same war.  

But in this case it does.

Perhaps if you were actually to research Christianity, rather than simply 
react to it naively and ignorantly, you would realize the many points of 
continuity between it and earlier, "pagan" religions, particularly  
regarding the Devil. This is why we call ourselves Satanists. We 
recognize the continuity of history and religion, rather than react 
blindly against something we don't understand. Of course, "satan" is not 
the ideal name for the Dark Power. "Adversary," while powerful, implies 
that one is challenging a greater power, when this is not the case. But 
it is the most common name by far, (worlds better than the next most 
common, "Lucifer,") and invokes the most powerful emotions. And it's just 
a cool-sounding word. But whether we call it "Satan," or else Tiamat, or 
Apep, or Shilyat, or Kali, or Coatlicue, it amounts to the same thing. To 
us, the Christian Bible is not canonical. But it is one of many texts 
which mentions, and attempts to explain, the Dark Lord, the Primal Abyss.
	Why do neo-pagans so often react so strongly to anything they 
think of as associated with Christianity? So often we Satanists are told 
that our beliefs are foolish, because all we are is Christians in 
reverse - a sure way to get yourself hurt in my presence - and yet, what 
does "Neo-Pagan" mean? A "new" version of an empty word, which once 
meant an Italian peasant, but was used by city-dwelling Christians as a 
blanket term for all who did not follow the Jewish-Christian religious 
spectrum, including other monotheists such as Zoroastrians and 
Neo-Platonists? Is this not far more blatant a form of anti-Christianity, 
of defining oneself *against* something? If it simply refers to a revival 
of ancient religions, then it is not itself a religion, but simply a 
blanket term, with pejorative connotations, is it not?

In the name of the World Serpent, Corpse-Tearer the Black,

ie Satanically Yours,


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