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To: alt.lucky.w,alt.magick.tyagi,alt.pagan,alt.religion.wicca,alt.traditional.witchcraft,alt.witchcraft
From: lorax666 
Subject: Wiccan Authority and Order
Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 00:56:27 GMT

50030217 VII First Spring Lunatix

re "McWicca" -- Religion, Magic, and Authority-Structures

"Cyric- The God of Free Pagan Usenet" AKA
"Talesin- The Bad Boy of Witchcraft" (tm) :
> ...I wrote ....  a term so poignant and relevant to neo Paganism that
> is has become part of the lexicon.  ...circulated worldwide, stolen

writing it and spreading it in the public seems conducive to it 
becoming utilized, whoever may have originated the term or may 
wish to take credit for it. more important is its import and 
the ramifications of its usage. 

	import : without your contextual reference, it implies
	         some commodification through association with
		 the popular convenience-food chain "McDonalds";
		 note that Peter Koenig has used the term "McOTO"
		 to describe the Order of the Temple of the East
		 for quite some time (preceding you?) and other
	         comparable uses in criticism probably precede
		 your posting of the term 'McWicca'.

		 within your contextual reference it refers to a
		 traditional dissonance between methods and
		 axioms of knowledge with respect to the 
	         lineage or art studied. (I.e. it simultaneously
		 implies either biased and contentious motives
		 on your part or your ignorance as regards 
		 how Wicca a a whole maintains its integrity.

	ramifications: as a criticism of a fellow Wiccan, 
		 it avails most not of benefit from its use,
		 outside confined expositions of the subject
		 proper (i.e. in larger bodies of work that
		 are attempting to discern betwixt trads or
		 identify certain problematic social strains.

		 mostly it affords greater tools for put-down,
		 which most Wiccans would not agree abides the
		 Wiccan Rede (and ought to be abandoned as such).
		
> ...published by ...authors ....

neato.

> ...started a huge battle ....

influential.

> ...has come to defines a whole religion.

mistakenly applied. the religion incorporates several 
different trajectories of authority inclusive of the 
solitary and less matriculatory (e.g. initiatic).

> The story of "Welcome to McWicca" ....

huge snip:

> [example] got in over his head and ended up desperately trying 
> to defend himself.  ...did ask for help and some outstanding 
> people tried to help him. When he didn't hear what he wanted, 
> he made up his own way and ended up biting the hands that 
> tried to feed him. He pretty much got what he deserved.

the Goddess does not desire Her children be punished for ignorance.
willful ignorance does appear to be self-destructive.

> Between this and the idea that one could go from "What is a BoS?" 
> to covened First Degree Buckland Initiate, 

sounds suspicious, doesn't it, for a short duration?
it wouldn't be entirely outside the bounds of historical
activities of magical organizations to exaggerate the
connection to and authority received from any particular
mystical or magical lineage. look at how Gardner, Crowley,
and a good number of other occultists sought the connection.

> experienced Magus, 

let the experienced Magus issue forth hir Word and be done.

> and persecuted Witch....

come now, you are surely aware of the romantic notions of
Charter Myths, fantasy-constructs facilitating authoritative
connections with other dimensions in learning and worship. 

persecution is one of the keywords associated with witchcraft
in the mind of a good number of the Western Esoteric Tradition.
it is the first consistent story I heard about from Wiccans,
which informed their mythos and ethos. regardless of the issue
of the individual whom you were criticizing, and the hubris
demonstrated in the contention / misunderstandin of the office
of Magus, why would the trajectory of persecution be at all an
indicator of corruption as regards Wicca? it seems pandemic in
the entire expanse of the Great Martyrdom Cult (incorporating
Christianity and some good portino of Neopaganism).
 
> ...I just managed to define them in one small word.

describe. insufficiently concise to define, and insufficiently
personal to truly elucidate an understanding of the authority
structures contained within the greater Wiccan community.

blessed beast!

lorax666
----------- ps

	one might inquire into the relation betwixt the use
	of a corrupted name of an Irish bard-mage (Taliesin)
	and criticism using an Irish-Scottish prefix for
	"son of" (Son of Wicca); one might also consider why
	it is valuable to perpetuate the 'Mc/Mac' demonizing
	as equatable to commodity, business success, and the
	typical degradation associated with these features;
	but these are both tangents to the present discussion.
 
	};>