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To: alt.magick.tantra,alt.religion.hindu,alt.religion.tantra,alt.religion.vaisnava
From: "Bhaktisiddhartha Dasanudas" 
Subject: Re: tantra sex and yoga.
Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 17:19:41 -0400

> Firstly, 'spirit' is nothing but a quality or behaviour of matter;

Oh-oh, somebody hasn't done their homework! Spirit is completely different
from matter. Matter is temporary, mechanical, passive and dull, while spirit
is eternal, living, active and conscious. Consciousness is the definitive
symptom of spirit. The source of all spirit is God, or the prime conscious
entity. This is the first lesson in spiritual life:

   "Those who are seers of the truth have concluded that of the
nonexistent there is no endurance, and of the existent there is no
cessation. This seers have concluded by studying the nature of
both." [Bhagavad-gita 2.18]

   "There is no endurance of the changing body. That the body is
changing every moment by the actions and reactions of the
different cells is admitted by modern medical science; and thus
growth and old age are taking place in the body. But the spirit
soul exists permanently, remaining the same despite all changes of
the body and the mind. That is the difference between matter and
spirit. By nature, the body is ever changing, and the soul is
eternal. This conclusion is established by all classes of seers of
the truth, both impersonalist and personalist. In the Visnu Purana
it is stated that Visnu and His abodes all have self-illuminated
spiritual existence. "Jyotimsi visnur bhuvanani visnuh". The words
existent and nonexistent refer only to spirit and matter. That is
the version of all seers of truth."

Material scientists theorize that consciousness occurs at a certain stage of
combination of material elements and biological structures, but since
consciousness is transcendental and immaterial, they have no way to measure
it. Therefore by the scientists' own standard of empirical verification,
their theory is unprovable.

> secondly, who's to say that sex is necessarily less spiritual than the
> 'material means' of, say, meditation?

Who says? God, that's who. He is also the primary object of meditation:

   "The Lord's magnanimous pastimes and the glowing glancing of His
smiling face are all indications of His extensive benedictions.
One must therefore concentrate on this transcendental form of the
Lord, as long as the mind can be fixed on Him by meditation."
[Srimad Bhagavatam 2.2.12]

   "In Bhagavad-gita (12.5) it is said that the impersonalist
undergoes a series of difficult programs on account of his
impersonal meditation. But the devotee, due to the Lord's personal
service, progresses very easily. Impersonal meditation is
therefore a source of suffering for the impersonalist. Here, the
devotee has an advantage over the impersonalist philosopher. The
impersonalist is doubtful about the personal feature of the Lord,
and therefore he always tries to meditate upon something which is
not objective. For this reason there is an authentic statement in
the Bhagavatam regarding the positive concentration of the mind on
the factual form of the Lord.
   The process of meditation recommended herein is bhakti-yoga, or
the process of devotional service after one is liberated from the
material conditions. Jnana-yoga is the process of liberation from
the material conditions. After one is liberated from the
conditions of material existence, i.e., when one is nivrtta, as
previously stated herein, or when one is freed from all material
necessities, one becomes qualified to discharge the process of
bhakti-yoga. Therefore bhakti-yoga includes jnana-yoga, or, in
other words, the process of pure devotional service simultaneously
serves the purpose of jnana-yoga; liberation from material
conditions is automatically achieved by the gradual development of
pure devotional service. These effects of bhakti-yoga are called
anartha-nivrtti. Things which are artificially acquired gradually
disappear along with the progress of bhakti-yoga. Meditation on
the lotus feet of the Personality of Godhead, the first
processional step, must show its effect by anartha-nivrtti. The
grossest type of anartha which binds the conditioned soul in
material existence is sex desire, and this sex desire gradually
develops in the union of the male and female. When the male and
female are united, the sex desire is further aggravated by the
accumulation of buildings, children, friends, relatives and
wealth. When all these are acquired, the conditioned soul becomes
overwhelmed by such entanglements, and the false sense of egoism,
or the sense of "myself" and "mine," becomes prominent, and the
sex desire expands to various political, social, altruistic,
philanthropic and many other unwanted engagements, resembling the
foam of the sea waves, which becomes very prominent at one time
and at the next moment vanishes as quickly as a cloud in the sky.
The conditioned soul is encircled by such products, as well as
products of sex desire, and therefore bhakti-yoga leads to gradual
evaporation of the sex desire, which is summarized in three
headings, namely profit, adoration and distinction. All
conditioned souls are mad after these different forms of sex
desire, and one shall see for himself how much he has been freed
from such material hankerings based primarily on the sex desire.
As a person feels his hunger satisfied after eating each morsel of
foodstuff, he must similarly be able to see the degree to which he
has been freed from sex desire. The sex desire is diminished along
with its various forms by the process of bhakti-yoga because
bhakti-yoga automatically, by the grace of the Lord, effectively
results in knowledge and renunciation, even if the devotee is not
materially very well educated. Knowledge means knowing things as
they are, and if by deliberation it is found that there are things
which are at all unnecessary, naturally the person who has
acquired knowledge leaves aside such unwanted things. When the
conditioned soul finds by culture of knowledge that material
necessities are unwanted things, he becomes detached from such
unwanted things. This stage of knowledge is called vairagya, or
detachment from unwanted things. We have previously discussed that
the transcendentalist is required to be self-sufficient and should
not beg from the rich blind persons to fulfill the bare
necessities of life. Sukadeva Gosvami has suggested some
alternatives for the bare necessities of life, namely the problem
of eating, sleeping and shelter, but he has not suggested any
alternative for sex satisfaction. One who has the sex desire still
with him should not at all try to accept the renounced order of
life. For one who has not attained to this stage, there is no
question of a renounced order of life. So by the gradual process
of devotional service under the guidance of a proper spiritual
master, and following the principles of the Bhagavatam, one must
be able at least to control the gross sex desire before one
accepts the renounced order of life factually.
   So purification means getting free gradually from sex desire,
and this is attained by meditation on the person of the Lord as
described herein, beginning from the feet. One should not try to
go upwards artificially without seeing for himself how much he has
been released from the sex desire. The smiling face of the Lord is
the Tenth Canto of Srimad-Bhagavatam, and there are many upstarts
who at once try to begin with the Tenth Canto and especially with
the five chapters which delineate the rasa-lila of the Lord. This
is certainly improper. By such improper study or hearing of
Bhagavatam, the material opportunists have played havoc by
indulgence in sex life in the name of Bhagavatam. This
vilification of Bhagavatam is rendered by the acts of the
so-called devotees; one should be free from all kinds of sex
desire before he tries to make a show of recital of Bhagavatam.
Sri Visvanatha Cakravarti Thakura clearly defines the import of
purification as cessation from sex indulgence. He says, yatha
yatha dhis ca sudhyati visaya-lampatyam tyajati, tatha tatha
dharayed iti citta-suddhi-taratamyenaiva dhyana-taratamyam uktam.
And as one gets free from the intoxication of sex indulgence by
purification of intelligence, one should step forward for the next
meditation, or in other words, the progress of meditation on the
different limbs of the transcendental body of the Lord should be
enhanced in proportion to the progress of purification of the
heart. The conclusion is that those who are still entrapped by sex
indulgence should never progress to meditation above the feet of
the Lord; therefore recital of Srimad-Bhagavatam by them should be
restricted to the First and Second Cantos of the great literature.
One must complete the purificatory process by assimilating the
contents of the first nine cantos. Then one should be admitted
into the realm of the Tenth Canto of Srimad-Bhagavatam."