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To: talk.religion.buddhism,alt.religion.buddhism,alt.magick.tyagi,alt.zen From: foot@pipeline.com (Steven A. Lightfoot) Subject: Re: General Buddhism (was Re: More Serious Questions) Date: Thu, 03 Apr 1997 14:30:24 GMT ardent19@idt.net wrote: >Here Foot goes again: >> To divide the world into phenomenal and non-phenomenal is not >> allowed in true Zen practice. Ardie: >Always trying to preach heresy - eh Foot? Foot: I carry my load. Ardie: Trying to dazzle beginners >minds with opinons that do not comport with the Bodhisattva canon - or >even Zen!!! Foot: Beginners and lurkers are your target Ardie, I have my hands full dealing with those that post. I have to keep reminding the beginners that I am not enlightened and not an official spokesman for anyone save my own experiences. Ardie: >If there is no "distinguishing" [your use of "divide" is barbaric] >betwixt the phenomenal body of the aggregates and the transcendent body >of the Buddha then why did Bodhidharma say the following: Foot: Because he was talking to ignorant people who needed to hear it like that. Ardie: >"The buddha is your real body, your original mind. This mind has no form >or characteristic, no cause or effect, no tendons or bones. Foot: No transcendence nor phenomonology. Ardie: It's like >space. You can't hold it. It's not the mind of materialists or >nihilists. Except for a Tathaagata, no one else - no mortal, no deluded >being - can fathom it." Foot: Sounds undivided to me. Still wouldn't walk it in front of a Mack Truck given the way things appear. Ardie: >Then Ch'an Master Hua-hai says: >"It [the Diamond-body] is imperceptible because its own nature is >formless substance which is intangible; hence it is called >imperceptible; and, since it is intangible, this substance is observed >to be profoundly still and neither vanishing nor appearing." Foot: More practically speaking, Soyen says, "From the standpoint of absolute truth, there is no such thing as mind or matter or even God or universe. But if we confine ourselves to this view and become blind to the other side, which says that the many exists, that the world actually is, we are like the man who has no legs; we are unable to move, we cannot carry ourselves, we are helpless, we cannot live our daily life. Philosophical insight may be far-reaching enough, but it is contentless, it lacks the material on which to work. Ardie: >And pray tell why does the Buddha say the following: >"The Tathaagatas cannot be seen in his ruupakaayato (corporeal body). >The dharmakaayas (the body of principles) are the Tathaagata." Foot: It cannot be seen, yes, however, now the rest of the story from Soyen: "For it is in the inherent nature of the Buddha-Body that it individualizes itself in the maniforlness of the phenomenal world. It does not stand alone outside particular existences, but it abides in them and animates them and makes them move freely. By thus abandoning its absolute transcendentality, it has subjected itself to certain conditions such as space, time, and causation. Its essence is infinite, but its manifestations are finite and limited. Therefore, the Buddha-Body has to wait to express itself in this relative world till all the necessary conditons are matured. This creation, so called, is no more than a manifestation of the self-limiting Budda-Body. Ardie: >The list goes on Foot - Foot: Who's stopping? Ardent: I suggest you study before you give out your >unfounded opinions. Foot: I suggest you don't walk your Self limiting Buddha Body in front of Mack Trucks like alt.zen. Ardie: You deserve a zenic beating - Whap!!! Foot: You never saw it coming. >Ardie Hell Foot: I know you think you've said it all when you post to so many groups and I welcome the opportunity to talk to so many intelligent and nice new people.
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