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To: alt.magick,alt.magick.serious,alt.magick.virtual-adepts,alt.pagan.magick,alt.paranormal.spells.hexes.magic
From: lilitu@dv238s33.lawrence.ks.us (Goddess in Training)
Subject: Re: I need some help please
Date: 16 May 1997 18:06:13 GMT

For starters, I want to emphasize that I'm saying this out of compassion,
not out of rudeness or hatred, even if I sound harsh at times. I sound
harsh because of experience and because I've seen similar situations in my
friends' lives.

LM wrote:
: I posted this message a few days ago, but haven't received any responses,
: nor have I seen the original message posted. I am looking for advice as
: well as any simple spells (I am new to this) or charms I could make to help
: me in the situation. I wish to emphasize I am not seeking to coerce or in
: any way harm any one, I suppose the best way to describe what I am seeking
: would be a "protection" from the manipulations of his mother. Any help is
: sincerely appreciated and I am posting this in all seriousness.

Inherently anything you do to "protect" him from his mother's influence
would be manipulative. Of course, manipulation isn't in and of itself a
bad thing. But if you are going to do it, be honest about it. 

: Thank you for your time

You're welcome. I'm not sure if you'll like my answers, but I'm being
honest with you.

: A close friend and I started dating last year and we had gotten very close
: and very serious ... including talk of marriage in the *future*. His
: mother, who has not had the best of marriages, yet remains married to his
: father, does not think he should ever get married. He has told his mother
: (and me) that he would not feel complete without a wife and children. (He
: is an only child and really wanted siblings). He was sent to boarding
: school when he was 8 years old so that his parents would not affect him
: with their fighting, however his mother came up every weekend to talk about
: all the horrible things his father was doing (his father is not perfect,
: but he is not the terrible person she portrays him to be). Recently, he has
: been getting closer to his father, something that drives his mother crazy.
: Additionaly, he and I became very close which also lessened her influence
: on him. His father bought him a new car, so his mother bought him a new
: townhouse and said that his father had to pay $10 a night to stay in "her"
: townhouse. She has also encouraged him to trade in his car before it hits
: 50,000 miles (even thought the car is paid for) to get maximum trade-in
: value. 

If he's that much of a "momma's boy," he's definitely not marriagable
material (yet at least). You've basically got two choices
here--considering it a blessing that you have split up now before you
married and still had to deal with his mother or waiting and seeing if he
wakes up and matures some. Personally, I'd go with the first one,
especially since it doesn't preclude the second one happening someday, but
then I've made the mistake of doing the second one as well. (I came to my
senses eventually.) His age is definitely something to consider--if he's
past his early 20's, he probably won't change. At any rate, he won't
change until he wants to change, and even if you can influence him to
"change," that just indicates that he's weak and easily manipulated. If
he's that easily manipulated by you and his mother, that means he's likely
to be manipulated by others too.
: I have had a compatiblility reading done on the two of us and I have been
: told that he is my soulmate. This is something I felt and believed prior to
: the reading. I was told we are very compatible but that an older woman with
: money and manipulative powers is coming between us. (The reading described
: her as evil and selfish and does not have is best interest at heart even
: though she thinks she does and cares for him a great deal)

Be wary of "compatibility readings," especially those that spread the myth
of "soulmates." The myth of soulmates has caused much sorrow and pain in
the world. (Psychological studies have shown that there are more than one
potential "soulmates"--what makes people attracted to each other isn't
just their inherent qualities. It's also a matter of the situation. If the
situation isn't right, a potential attraction will not be acted upon.)

: My question is, Is there something I can do to allow him to see what she
: has done ? We have tried talking about it (and I will admit, I didn't do it
: very well since I was angry) and he gets defensive and protective of his
: mother. This is something she has been doing his entire life, so he does
: not see just how well she manipulates him. He has stated on several
: occasions that while his mother might think she controls his life, she does
: not. Since he feels so strongly about this, he is unwilling to even
: consider the possibility that he has been manipulated into feeling insecure
: about his future.

You've told him about it. That's all you can do. Even if he does see it,
it's natural to be defensive in that situation (attacking a close family
member, even if it's legitimate). If he's suffering from the delusion that
he isn't allowing her to control him, then he's likely to suffer from
other delusions as well. (Yes, he *allows* her to control him--no one can
make you behave a certain way. You choose to let someone influence you.)

: I feel that this relationship was the one that was meant to be. I have
: never been so happy or content or felt so right with anyone else. 

If this is your happiest or most content relationship, you must either not
have had many relationships or your other relationships must have been
pretty awful. Remember: no relationship is "meant to be." Relationships
take work, and it takes work on both sides. He isn't wanting to make it
work for whatever reason, so you can't force it to work if he won't help.

I want
: this relationship to work, and I do not want to *compel* him to return to
: me, but I do want him to evaluate both our relationship and his potential
: as "marriageable material" (which I whole hearted believe he is ... the
: reading I had also confirmed this) without the negative influences from his
: mother. 

As I said before, he's inherently not marriageable material as long as he
stays a mamma's boy. As long as he's playing substitute husband for his
mother, he won't ever be a true husband to anyone else. 

: Any help is greatly appreciated. 

From what you've described, he's definitely old enough that change is
unlikely (you said he was in grad school). He also doesn't seem to want to
change. My advice would be to forget the spells to coerce him and run as
fast as you can before it's too late. 

My last boyfriend was also a mamma's boy, and I should have dumped him
months ago. (It was long distance, or else it wouldn't have lasted nearly
so long.) At least yours can stay in school--mine had been out two years
and couldn't keep a job. Why? His dad and mom had fought over him (sound
familiar?), although they were divorced, not together like in your
situation. He lived with his mother and his father payed for everything,
including expensive computer equipment. He never had to work for anything
in his life, so he didn't have the discipline to keep a job down. (Any job
he was lucky enough to get, he'd be fired from in about a month.) It took
me a while, but needless to say, I finally opened my eyes and dumped him.
He's still back living with mommy and unemployed, but at least I'm free of
him. Yours doesn't sound nearly as bad as mine, but the same tendencies
are there. He maybe has more potential than mine (not that mine didn't,
except that he was too lazy to actually act on it), but unless he chooses
to use his potential, he's still not even dating material, not to mention
marriage material.

It's your choice whether or not to wait and see if he grows up or just to
get on with your life and find someone a bit more mature. I don't think
magick is what you need in your situation.

Renee
lilitu@cjnetworks.com