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Tarot and Astrology

To: alt.magick.tyagi,alt.astrology,alt.tarot,alt.divination,alt.magick,alt.pagan.magick
From: Di-a-rama 
Subject: Re: Tarot and Astrology (Decans, Faces and Planetary Order)
Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 19:09:52 GMT

On 1/4/04 2:13 AM, in article B2PJb.6478$,
"nagasiva"  wrote:

> # A division of each sign into three 10 degrees segments. There
> # is a Hindu division of each sign into three decans ruled by the
> # three signs of the same element. There is a Chaldean division
> # of each sign into three 10 degrees faces ruled by the seven
> # classical planets in Chaldean order, starting with Mars ruling
> # the first Face of Aries.
> #
> # ...
> # 
> # FACE: 
> # The weakest form of essential dignity, "like a man about to be
> # turned out of doors.". Each sign is divided into three 10 degrees
> # faces, and a different planet has dignity in each face of the sign.
> # See Decanate.
> here we apparently have a combination of Theories B *&* E!
> and yet there is distinction: Hindu decanate, Chaldean faces.

Not sure if you were seeking responses as your post was a rather
self-contained package...

I have Anthony Louis' book "Horary Astrology Made Simple" which is mostly
based on the traditional practices of 17th century English astrologer
William Lilly.  He refers to Decans and Faces on p. 98.  While he does not
cite a source for the Decan divisions or their uses, the book states as
above that they are Hindu in origin.  Since traditional European astrology
is a patchwork of many sources, it does not surprise me that something from
Hindy astrology would insinuate its way into western practice.  Whether they
are correct or not almost doesn't matter--Decans in the context of Horary
astrology are not used to assign dignity to a planet/luminary, but Faces
*are* used.

Louis also states the application of Decan rulers is used by modern
astrologers--I'm not sure if he is implying that it is a newly adopted
modern practice, or what.  However, that does not account for the reference
in Agrippa you cited (Chapter XXXVI, Book II).  In this chapter, Agrippa
states that his sources are Egyptian, Indian and Chaldean.  He then goes on
to describe general talismans based on elemental properties which is
probably the reason for referring to Decanates.

Also, Agrippa's material (including the Decanates) generally applies toward
crafting astrological talismans rather than relaying relative power to the
planets in other astrological contexts.  Regardless, Face is the most
paltry, undesirable level of essential dignity there is--the consolation
prize.  (Lilly gives points:  +1 for face, +2 for terms, +3 for triplicity,
+4 for exaltation and +5 for rulership.  Lack of essential dignity is called
'peregrine' and is worth -5 points.)

Anyway, Agrippa's talismans are whole packages with several factors required
to make them effective.  In ch XLI, bk II (p. 386), an image of the Sun is
made thus:

Sun Hour
1st face of Leo Ascending with the Sun
Sun ascending in exaltation
(Make an image as described)

From this we get:

Sunrise on a Sunday when the Sun is in 1-10 degrees of Leo.  If we're
looking at any other traditional practices, we'll probably also make the
moon waxing, not ill-dignified, and applying in a good aspect to the Sun.
But the real meat of this election is how the Sun is made fortunate by sign
and house placement plus hour/day rulers.

Ultimately, I think application of Face rulers to Tarot cards is misleading.
It takes the meaning out of context and tries to force fit it into a system
that is already complete in itself.  I'm not sure if this agrees with the
original post--it seemed like the gist was to show how things are mindlessly
perpetuated and appropriated.  Perhaps the best answer to this is to try it
and see if it works.


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