THE ARCANE ARCHIVE
	a cache of usenet and other text files pertaining to occult, mystical, and spiritual subjects.

To: alt.magick.tyagi,alt.magick.sex,alt.religion.sexuality,alt.sex.wizards,alt.magick.tantra
From: nagasiva@luckymojo.com (nagasiva yronwode)
Subject: Semen Retention and Mysticism (was wasting semen)
Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2001 04:42:40 GMT

50010108 Vom

garyboombaats@aol.com (GaryBoomBaats):
> How do you retain the seman the way you speak [of],

you didn't include the text to which you were responding, so I'll just
pretend that you are open to any descriptions.

semen-retention appears to be based upon three main factors:
psychological state and intention, physical condition, and 
coordination by partner(s). I'll comment on each below.

A) psychological state and intention

	taboo-conditioning surrounding ejaculation is a mental
trick using fear to forestall ejaculatory orgasm (and therefore any
kind of ego-dissolution). the intensity of this conditioning will 
vary and focus on some psychospiritual goals, punishments, moral 
prescriptions, and/or potential results of the loss of what is in all
likelihood regarded as a some kind of "vital essence" will become the
intended obsession of the mystic. however, like the sand in a Buddhist 
mandala, this 'essence' is symbolic and not in any way crucial to 
mystical experience. how retention affects one's experience of an 
intentional and symbolic act of sexual ecstasy is the real reason that 
these taboos are introduced into tantric instruction by masters. just
as burning the wooden Buddha for warmth is understood by traditionals
to be a reasonable act given the depletion of the wood pile, so 
enthusiastically ejecting of the joyous jism for fun and pleasure
as a vacation (pun intended) from discipline can be regarded with 
smiling admiration by the liberated sex mystic.

B) physical condition

	from diet and exercise to breath-control and meditation, what
one does physically affects one's psychological condition and one's
mystical state. spirituality is based upon material considerations,
though spiritualists may trumpet the opposite in order to get you to 
abandon physical pleasure. in some measure the relaxation of certain
muscles (e.g. abdominal and leg) and deep breathing can have a valuable 
forestalling effects. there are many similar testimonies provided by
popular references on improving sex and I urge you to consult them as
a preparation before studying the teachings of mystics who may have no
idea of the biological basis to mystical experiences.
	
C) coordination by partner(s)

	the rhythm of mental and spiritual ecstasies is subject to
influence by all participants in the energetic dance. coordination of
objectives and state-changes is important in an attempt to avoid 
orgasm of any type (or indeed in some circumstances to achieve it).

> I read what was written about the holding back urination until it 
> is slowed and slowed.  

that would be the strengthening of the 'PC' muscle for the purposes 
of aggressively stopping ejaculation in its initial phases. this can
be effective to a point. I find it can occasionally decrease my time
for repose. as a sexual technique, this can be very helpful.

> Whats a good book to learn this, do you need a book?  

you can find most valuable methods online, I'd guess. Anand has some
in her books which I have quoted online, and Chia and others seem to
like the potentially hazardous practice of drawing semen back up
into the bladder through the urethra once it has been ejaculated.

it may seem strange, but I have NEVER seen a satisfactory overview of
male ejaculatory control. too often the focus was on pressure to the
perineum, which seems rather an extreme and last-ditch method, when
instead a yogic attunement to one's own bodily rhythms, sensitivities,
pressure and relaxation responses are what are most easily introduced
into sexual interactions.

> Are you holding back ALL the seman, I have been able to hold back 
> most of it, but not all and it was not very satisfying feeling.  

first thing you should ask yourself is why you are doing it. if you
are trying to get an indirect ecstatic feeling out of it I think
that you will be disappointed unless you are interested in taking more
time with your sexuality, exploring it beyond these interruptions.
holding back from any ejaculation is valuable within certain
methods of discipline, but there is no consistent and authoritative
single goal involved here, so one might view such interruption at
this point as futile or worthless (because the objective could be
to avoid ever having to 'hold back' by virtue of carefully keeping
to less intense states of excitement), while you might be much better
served to enjoy the spiritually valuable experience of orgasm seeing
that this is what is naturally occurring. 

some (hedonistic) religious think that the inhibition of orgasm is 
a sin against nature. mystics attempting to INTENSIFY ejaculatory or 
other types of orgasms might work on extending pre-ejaculatory time 
and then, when the time was right, letting one's circumstance and
preparation instigate the resultant condition.

without knowing what you are attempting to achieve I could not
easily advise you on this, however.

> How do you retain the seman if durring the night it would
> be expeled in a dream if you didnt take care the urge yourself?  

while I would not personally recommend the practice, one way that
a man could resist nocturnal emission is through binding. that is,
wearing firmly-fitting underwear or some other kind of restraint
that would prevent physical feelings from influencing excitement.
this is not sure-fire, but it would be preventative.

if you were trying to avoid this long-term without the aid of
outside support, then one way is to condition yourself into
thinking that emission has dire consequences (such as destroying
your chance to achieve any mystical objectives you may have, or
that the fluid from your ejaculate will connect two electrodes
and kill you; or that your deity has ordered you never to come 
-- anything that will induce fear during the period of excitation).

another way would be to reward yourself for performing well in
sexual contexts. that is, when you have successfully intended
and achieved extension of pre-ejaculatory periods, then shower
yourself with compensation -- be that gustatory, lucrative, or
ejaculatory.

to put this in the context of what *I* consider to be tantra,
it is not the retention or expulsion of semen that is the focus
of practice per se, but the ecstatic dissolution of ego through
whatever means one selects in order enjoy what is called by some
a communion with the divine. 

therefore regardless of whether one might succeed or fail in 
achieving some physical result is quite beside the point if, in 
the process, one's mystical result is achieved. different mystics 
may require different levels of discipline in order to achieve 
comparable results, and the goals mystics have will only 
occasionally coincide. those who push for Authorized Methods are
either fundamentalists or attempting to assist through clever
incentive tactics.

namaste

nagasiva
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